what is the most humane culling practice for pinkies???

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what is the most humane culling practice for pinkies???

Post by mousefan on Sun May 26, 2013 8:10 pm

Hello, I am new here, and hope to start breeding tans this fall, but! I.m a little nervous about culling.
At first I thought it would be easy to just do euthanasia, but I found out it doesn't work for pinkies.
are there any other methods that don't involve anything hands on?

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Re: what is the most humane culling practice for pinkies???

Post by Laigaie on Mon May 27, 2013 1:10 am

What do you mean by euthanasia? Pinkies can't be gassed, but that's all that doesn't work.

I freeze pinkies before they hit 3 days old. They have no ability to thermoregulate, so they die quickly and fairly painlessly. Other folks throw them hard against the floor (a bit hands-on) or thump their skulls in (very hands-on). One they're old enough to start growing fur (3 days the skin cells develop and they start to thermoregulate), these methods are your best bet until the mouse is large enough for cervical dislocation (also very hands-on) or gassing (obviously hands-free but complicated).
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Re: what is the most humane culling practice for pinkies???

Post by mousefan on Mon May 27, 2013 9:35 am

Thank you, I will consider trying the freezer.

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Re: what is the most humane culling practice for pinkies???

Post by seafolly on Sat Jun 01, 2013 7:00 pm

I used the freezer with my first litter but the concept stressed me out too much so I use the blunt force trauma method now with pinkies. For me the instant factor sets my mind at ease (one minute they're snuggling with their siblings, then they're gone). Everyone's different though with their comfort levels.
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Re: what is the most humane culling practice for pinkies???

Post by mousefan on Mon Jun 03, 2013 10:41 am

Yeah, I may have trouble sleeping, thinking of poor pups struggling in the freezer! So I will probably through them out before bedtime Big smile

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Re: what is the most humane culling practice for pinkies???

Post by Laigaie on Mon Jun 03, 2013 8:43 pm

They don't struggle, if it helps. They slow down, shut down, and freeze solid.
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Re: what is the most humane culling practice for pinkies???

Post by mousefan on Mon Jun 03, 2013 9:35 pm

Oh, that's a relief!

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Re: what is the most humane culling practice for pinkies???

Post by seafolly on Wed Jun 05, 2013 11:55 am

Yeah it wasn't struggling that I was worried about, more the, "Oh crap, it's cold, we better find momma asap!" And I realize I'm probably giving their minds too much credit but I worry. Wink

p.s. Someone apparently doesn't like culling. *looking at the reputation we got*
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Re: what is the most humane culling practice for pinkies???

Post by Laigaie on Wed Jun 05, 2013 6:01 pm

Eesh! Admins! This forum is not anti-culling! Why are we getting stinky cheeses for discussing culling in a thread that explicitly warns folks that the thread will contain culling? :/
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Re: what is the most humane culling practice for pinkies???

Post by tinyhartmouseries on Thu Jun 06, 2013 1:16 am

That's a fantastic question. I, myself, accidentally gave one while trying to figure out how to change them, I must check with Elena about this.

To the mysterious lurker-Laigaie is completely right. We are not anti-culling, and educated, frank discussion (with warning) is the best way to ensure it's performed accurately and with as little suffering as possible. I would thank you to message me privately if you are still struggling with this, rather than to continue to give low ratings.
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Re: what is the most humane culling practice for pinkies???

Post by mousefan on Thu Jun 06, 2013 9:40 am

Whats the cheese thing all about? Is it bad O.O

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Re: what is the most humane culling practice for pinkies???

Post by mouselover01 on Thu Jun 06, 2013 10:45 am

I would have to say, if I had to go some odd way, I'd probably rather die of cold. --odd, but I hate the heattt THAT much.

That's what I do with pinkys. I Co2 the rest.

As far as the ratings go, I almost gave another one trying to fix it lol. Then I read emmas comment and laughed.

I'm trying to figure out how to change it. I didn't setup the system but I'll figure it out... MUHAHA.



Whoever is giving stinky cheese ratings, please Private message me---- I'm the admin and owner of this board and would like to speak with you. Otherwise I'll also see if I can find the IP address or username of those who rated this and I'll see if I can have a word with them that way Happy
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Re: what is the most humane culling practice for pinkies???

Post by mousefan on Fri Jun 07, 2013 9:40 pm

mouselover, are you the owner of snowy peaks mousery?

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Re: what is the most humane culling practice for pinkies???

Post by mouselover01 on Fri Jun 07, 2013 9:40 pm

Yes Happy
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Re: what is the most humane culling practice for pinkies???

Post by Mrs. Beach on Fri Jun 07, 2013 11:22 pm

Folks, it is possible to euthanize pinkies with C02. It just takes a very, very, very long time because their lungs are so little.
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Re: what is the most humane culling practice for pinkies???

Post by mouselover01 on Sat Jun 08, 2013 12:59 am

AVMA


S2.2.4.2.1 Inhaled agents
Inhaled anesthetics
—Nonflammable volatile anesthetic agents are effective for both in utero fetuses and
neonatal rodents. Neonatal mice may take up to 50
minutes to die from CO2 exposure.
Adequate expo-sure time should be provided, or an adjunctive method
(eg, cervical dislocation, or decapitation) should be
performed after a neonate is nonresponsive to painful
stimuli





S2.2.4.2.2 Physical Methods
Hypothermia—The gradual cooling of fetuses and
altricial neonates is acceptable with conditions. As cold
surfaces can cause tissue damage and presumably pain,
the animals should not come in direct contact with ice
or precooled surfaces. Hypothermia for anesthesia is
not recommended after approximately 7 days of age.
Therefore, it is also an unacceptable euthanasia method in animals older than this age.

Fetuses that are believed to be unconscious and altricial neonates
<5 days of age that do not have sufficient nervous system
development to perceive pain may be quickly killed by
rapidly freezing in liquid N2
(liquid nitrogen)



I don't know if above they promote the use of a normal freezer for pinkies under a certain age. It sounds like they do based on the words "gradual cooling" but then they talk about liquid nitrogen at the bottom which is NOT gradual cooling. It sounds like freezer (so long as the babies aren't too old and aren't put on a cold surface), liquid nitrogen, Co2 exposure, cervical dislocation, decapitation, etc are all acceptable forms of euthanasia.

I have this guide printed and in a binder in my animal room. Kinda morbid but an interesting read none-the-less.
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Re: what is the most humane culling practice for pinkies???

Post by Mrs. Beach on Sat Jun 08, 2013 10:28 am

It is reassuring to have scientific confirmation. Thanks, Mouselover01!
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Re: what is the most humane culling practice for pinkies???

Post by mousefan on Sat Jun 08, 2013 10:33 am

Mouselover, I think we've been in touch on facebook, I LOVE your site!!!
Your in Rochester, right? Im in Chuatagay lake, between plattsburgh and potsdam, I don't think im going to rochester any time soon, but it would be nice to meet you Happy

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Re: what is the most humane culling practice for pinkies???

Post by mouselover01 on Sat Jun 08, 2013 12:15 pm

Happy No problem.

And yeah, hi! Thank You!! Whenever you plan a trip in this direction let me know and we can meet up!
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Re: what is the most humane culling practice for pinkies???

Post by mousefan on Mon Jun 10, 2013 10:35 pm

That would be fun!

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