Tail Kinks

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Tail Kinks

Post by candycorn on Fri Apr 20, 2012 8:04 pm





So my pied blue is a lovely lady and a good momma....but I am really being thrown a curve ball.
I have three more born with tail kinks. That's two from the last show breeding I did...and 3 from this one.
The mice are distantly related. One grandfather on one side is the great grandfather on another. It's pretty distant for mice!
So why the tail kinks?
Is it something I am doing?
Is there something I can do now?
I had a runt with two tail kinks and two babies with one kink. I culled the runt tonight and I will cull the other two kinked pups tomarrow...which leaves her with five.
Their color is also not coming in solid and I am wondering if I have pied. That would be really wacky since there are no visible pied parents on the pedigree of the father. Which I have up to three generations.
Oy.

Any idea on the origins of tail kinks?
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Re: Tail Kinks

Post by bethmccallister on Fri Apr 20, 2012 8:38 pm

Oh yeah, you definitely have pied in there. I get tail kinks occasionally so I'm interested if anyone has information on it too. I just usually cull the bubs that have it but I don't get it all the time and it's usually random in different lines.
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Re: Tail Kinks

Post by Mrs. Beach on Fri Apr 20, 2012 9:20 pm

I've been getting quite a few in litters from two related mice (same breeder), crossed. It must be a recessive thing. I think it is possible to breed it out, but what a bother along the way.
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Re: Tail Kinks

Post by Rhasputin on Fri Apr 20, 2012 11:17 pm

As far as I know, at least in my case, the tail kinks are genetic. They seem to be a recessive gene. That is to say, if you get some in a litter, just don't breed them, and it should go away if you're diligent enough.

I had a couple generations with tail kinks, I know the father is the carrier. When bred with an unrelated mouse, no kinks, when bred to his daughter, kinks.

Piebald is recessive, so it could have been hiding for a while, and be just now popping up. Happy
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Re: Tail Kinks

Post by Mrs. Beach on Sat Apr 21, 2012 12:06 am

Thanks for the good tail kink advice, Rhasputin!
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Re: Tail Kinks

Post by LittleSniffs on Sat Apr 21, 2012 12:37 am

I've had 2 pied litters now and thats how our mice looked.

It stinks about the kinked tails,t he one looks pretty bad. I have the one you gave me then one from Mrs. Beach with kinks, I love them both, such sweeties!!!
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Re: Tail Kinks

Post by Stina on Sat Apr 21, 2012 1:48 am

Personally, I don't think its a simple recessive. I think there is more to it. I haven't had kinks in a long time...and they seem to have stopped since I added dog food to my native eart/harlan teklad blocks. I also think I only ever had 1 or 2 in any litters that had it, and that was out of decent sized litters...and I don't recall getting any in repeat litters. I'm sure there is a genetic link...but perhaps it is a predisposition relating to calcium or something, rather than a straight up "tail kink" gene...

I've also had tail kinks that went away as babies matured...and kinks that weren't apparent until babies were like 3 weeks old.

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Re: Tail Kinks

Post by Rhasputin on Sat Apr 21, 2012 1:30 pm

Stina, I'm not positive it's a simple recessive either. Though, I have no evidence to suggest what other things factor into it. Sad
It might be similar to manx, how it never seems to work out exactly when you want it to, lol.
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Re: Tail Kinks

Post by kawmice on Tue Apr 24, 2012 4:11 am

I was always told tail kinks can happen for two reasons.....

Injury during or after birth

Genetic issue - some lines pass them down readily and others maybe only one or two pop up.

I do agree that it is not a simple recessive but I can't give any proof to back it up. lol
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Re: Tail Kinks

Post by Mrs. Beach on Tue Apr 24, 2012 12:39 pm

Calcium makes sense since tails are made of bone. I, also, had a mouse who outgrew his tail kink.
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Re: Tail Kinks

Post by Rhasputin on Tue Apr 24, 2012 2:31 pm

Usually a mouse doesn't outgrow the kink, it just gets pushed more into place as the mouse grows. It'll still be there, just not as evident. You can see this by looking at some photos of pinky mice where the tails will be completely curled up, but as adults, the tail is kinked in 2 or 3 places, and not curled like when it was a baby.
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Re: Tail Kinks

Post by Mrs. Beach on Tue Apr 24, 2012 2:36 pm

Mmm. OK. Tx.
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Re: Tail Kinks

Post by Stina on Tue Apr 24, 2012 4:58 pm

Sure they can outgrow a kink....bones change, as an animal grows and matures the shape of bones changes...each side of a bone doesn't have to grow at the same rate....if an animal is in an odd position in the womb for example, it can cause things to be shaped funny at birth and then as the bones grow they can straighten out and correct. Dietary levels of calcium and associated nutrients, and the ability of the body to process those things normally can drastically affect how the bones mature as well. Most genetic type bone abnormalities will not look better as an animal matures, they will look about the same, or get more obvious.

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Re: Tail Kinks

Post by Rhasputin on Tue Apr 24, 2012 5:05 pm

I didn't say it wasn't possible. tongue
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Re: Tail Kinks

Post by Stina on Tue Apr 24, 2012 5:09 pm

I've definitely had bubs that had fairly obvious kinks when super young, have absolutely no sign whatsoever of a kink by the time they were weaned.

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Re: Tail Kinks

Post by Mrs. Beach on Tue Apr 24, 2012 6:51 pm

My boy's kink straightened out by about a month and a half after weaning. Or maybe that's just when I noticed it. It was still kinked at weaning.
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Re: Tail Kinks

Post by candycorn on Thu Apr 26, 2012 8:53 pm

Well rats...two more with kinked tails. That means that 5 out of the 8 originals had kinks. Oy! So frustrating.
The good news is the high white one I will keep as a pet. And the other is reserved by a bloke in DC...so I have one doe and one buck available for adoption.
Here are the girls...




And here is the boy in front of his sisters!

They are lovely! It's really a shame about those tails!

OH and as far as kinks growing out..I have not personally seen it yet. It seems to get worse in the cases I raised. Here is the buck going to his new home this weekend.
at 3 weeks

at 4 weeks

And Today at 9 weeks

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