Black Texel and breeding Satins

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Black Texel and breeding Satins

Post by doganddisc on Mon Apr 02, 2012 1:45 am

Okay, so I read most of "Introductory Mouse Genetics" today- what a good read it is! Very clear information, easy to understand.

Here's two questions I have:

1) When breeding a satin to a non-satin, is it possible to end up with satins? Or do you need to breed satin to satin to get satins (and if you do, will you have all satins or could you end up with some non-satin)?

2) If a breed a standard black self mouse to a texel chocolate (or another texel with a recessive color), would it be possible for me to get a black texel in the litter?

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Re: Black Texel and breeding Satins

Post by Love2read on Mon Apr 02, 2012 1:53 am

1) Satin is recessive, so you must breed a Satin to a mouse that carries or expresses Satin. So, you can breed them to a Satin, which would result in all Satin babies, or you can breed them to a Satin Carrier(a normal-looking mouse that carries the Satin gene), which would result in 75% Satins. You could also breed 2 Satin Carriers, which would result in 50% Satins.

2) I'm still new to genetics myself, but I beleive that since Chocolate is simply dilute black then, yes, you could end up with Black Texels. However, the standard mouse would need to carry the Angora gene since Texel is a combination of Angora(which is recessive, like Satin) and Rex(which is dominant, so only one parent needs the gene).
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Re: Black Texel and breeding Satins

Post by Love2read on Mon Apr 02, 2012 1:55 am

I edited my post to add a couple extra details. Wink
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Re: Black Texel and breeding Satins

Post by doganddisc on Mon Apr 02, 2012 1:56 am

Fantastic, thank you so much!

Another question- if I breed a splash to a self, will any of the babies be splash? (Splash is recessive...right?)

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Re: Black Texel and breeding Satins

Post by Stina on Mon Apr 02, 2012 1:59 am

1. Satin is recessive. i.e., 2 copies, one from each parent, is necessary for the mouse to be satin. You don't NEED 2 satins to produce satin, but they have to at least carry it.

2. Texel is a combination of rex and (usually) angora....rex is dominant...so you would most likely get black rexes, but angora is recessive, so unless the black carried angora, you would only get rexes. If the black DOES carry angora, you could get black texel, if the odds turn out on your side.



...lol...I'm slow...

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Re: Black Texel and breeding Satins

Post by Love2read on Mon Apr 02, 2012 2:00 am

Splash is a gene that I'm still working on figuring out, so hopefully someone else with more knowledge will come along soon to help you out, but I do believe that it's recessive...
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Re: Black Texel and breeding Satins

Post by m137b on Mon Apr 02, 2012 2:01 am

It would depend on the self.

Splashed is dominant, but it is only expressed if the animal is c-dilute[with the exception of c/c which will not show splashing] If the self is a c-dilute, yes you have a very good chance of splashed offspring. If the self is not a c-dilute, then you will only get splashed offspring if the self carries a c-dilute.

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Re: Black Texel and breeding Satins

Post by Love2read on Mon Apr 02, 2012 2:04 am

Thanks m137b! I knew it wasn't simple dominant, but couldn't remember if it was recessive or simply needed something else(c-dilute) to express itself. Now I know. Wink
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Re: Black Texel and breeding Satins

Post by Stina on Mon Apr 02, 2012 2:07 am

Yep, splash is dominant. It actually IS a simple dominant gene, the mouse either is splashed, or isn't...there is no way to distinguish Spl/Spl from Spl/spl. As Cindy said, it's just only VISIBLE on c-diluted mice besides c/c (technically also on p/p mice, but only when they are young, they have light splashes that fade away as they mature). Undiluted mice and c/c mice can still be splashed genetically, and produce splashed, you just can't tell they are splashed b/c it works by undiluting a diluted color....if a mouse is already black, it can't undilute to black...it already is black.

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Re: Black Texel and breeding Satins

Post by kawmice on Mon Apr 02, 2012 11:12 am

I have a question- what you guys are saying is that if you take a satin carrier and want satin you MUST breed her to another satin carrier? Stina- the black splashed I got from you last fest- does he carry satin? I got one satin pup from his litter and mom was not satin.
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Re: Black Texel and breeding Satins

Post by Stina on Mon Apr 02, 2012 11:30 am

I would say I don't know off hand....but if he produced satin he and the doe both must.

You can only get satin by having 2 copies of the gene....2 mice that are not satin, but carry it, will produce ~25% satin offspring. That's how all recessive genes work.

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Re: Black Texel and breeding Satins

Post by kawmice on Mon Apr 02, 2012 12:01 pm

That makes sense. Thanks. Happy
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Re: Black Texel and breeding Satins

Post by Rhasputin on Mon Apr 02, 2012 12:46 pm

Satin x Satin = all satin

Satin x Satin carrier = some satin

Satin carrier x Satin carrier = some satin

Non-satin non-carrier x non-satin non-carrier = no satin

Happy
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Re: Black Texel and breeding Satins

Post by doganddisc on Tue Apr 03, 2012 3:32 pm

Rhasputin wrote:Satin x Satin = all satin

Satin x Satin carrier = some satin

Satin carrier x Satin carrier = some satin

Non-satin non-carrier x non-satin non-carrier = no satin

Happy

And if it's non-satin non-carrier x satin carrier, that equals no satin as well, correct?

Thank you so much for this!

So if I were to manage to produce a black rex and breed said rex to a texel, I could end up with a black texel?

I have some planning to do Happy
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Re: Black Texel and breeding Satins

Post by WindyHill on Tue Apr 03, 2012 6:03 pm

Very helpful thread!
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Re: Black Texel and breeding Satins

Post by doganddisc on Tue Apr 03, 2012 6:32 pm

WindyHill wrote:Very helpful thread!

I agree!
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Re: Black Texel and breeding Satins

Post by m137b on Tue Apr 03, 2012 8:11 pm

doganddisc wrote:

So if I were to manage to produce a black rex and breed said rex to a texel, I could end up with a black texel?

I have some planning to do Happy

Yes, if you breed a black rex that is out of a texel[so it carries angora] to a texel you should get texels.

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Re: Black Texel and breeding Satins

Post by lunalady on Wed Apr 04, 2012 10:20 am

You seemed to really enjoy that book, so I ordered it. Now I can't wait to read it.


Last edited by lunalady on Wed Apr 04, 2012 10:21 am; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : add on)

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